dumb_question Posted December 27, 2002 Posted December 27, 2002 I am planning to start an online shop out of Ohio. ohio has dozens of counties and different counties have different sales tax rates. is there anyway I could configure oscommerce that different county rates are taken into account. Dumb question
mugitty Posted December 27, 2002 Posted December 27, 2002 I suspect that there might be a way to do it via either a ZIP code table or through changing the 'Suburb' field in the customer information to accomodate the need (I don't have the answer, as I'm not a coder, but that would be my guess). My reason for responding is to alert you to a possible "easy" way out - you'll have to check with the local sheriff of course (and you might even try 2 or 3 different authorities just to see if you get the same answer - government agencies are notorious around here for not knowing the right answer sometimes). In Washington, even though there are differing tax rates throughout the state, we are only required to charge at the rate that exists in the location from where we are doing business - so I am able to set just one tax rate for any shipment going anywhere in the state. ... if you want to REALLY see something that doesn't set up right out of the box without some tweaking, try being a Foster Parent!
dumb_question Posted December 27, 2002 Author Posted December 27, 2002 Thanks for your response! i did talk to local taxation office. They " we can only tell you what to do and not how to do it" but when I suggested that if I collect the maximum sales tax for the state and pay everything to the county...he seemed to be fine with that! Dumb_question
mugitty Posted December 28, 2002 Posted December 28, 2002 ... exactly why I suggested talking to more than one office. The state level office rather than local might give you a different (?better?) answer ... if you want to REALLY see something that doesn't set up right out of the box without some tweaking, try being a Foster Parent!
abilstein Posted December 28, 2002 Posted December 28, 2002 Texas has multiple tax rates as well, and we have been charging our local rate. When I initially researched this I didn't find a definitive answer, although several people said this was the 'accepted' way of doing it. I can't imagine trying to account for all the county and city taxes in Texas. Oh yeah, and zip codes will not work if you were to attempt something like that, as they do not fall neatly across county/city boundaries. ...Alex
dumb_question Posted December 28, 2002 Author Posted December 28, 2002 thanks for your input guys...I think as long as I pay the government whatever I collect, they wouldnt care if buyers from certain counties get charged at a higher rate. At the most, i will have to write them a refund check!! Dumb_Question
Guest Posted December 30, 2002 Posted December 30, 2002 I went to a sales tax workshop here in Florida recently and the state DOR speaker said we have to collect tax for the count where the item is received! This seems to be in conflict with common usage and will be almost impossible to implement correctly. Florida also has some really wierd rules on when to collect taxes. For instance, if my local auto mechanic does something to the car but doesn't replace any parts I don't get charged tax. On the other hand, if he a nut is missing and he puts a new one on, he's supposed to charge tax on the entire transaction -- labor and the nut. Jim
Ryanc Posted December 31, 2002 Posted December 31, 2002 UGHHHH! I'm ready to populate my store with products and now I've ran into this sales tax problem as well. I'm in Oklahoma and I've received 3 different answers from 3 different government workers. The most disturbing answer was that I had to charge the sales tax rate of the *customers location*! And now for the last hour I've been trying to figure what I should do as I experiment with the tax zones and tax rates in OSC. :shock:
Guest Posted December 31, 2002 Posted December 31, 2002 You're probably pretty safe if you just collect the tax for your county or city in addition to the state tax. They'll ding you if you're audited, though. An alternative is to just let the customer figure the tax and include it. In Florida, anyway, you don't have to worry if you ship out of state. It's the customer's responsibility to pay their applicable tax. At the same time, you're responsible for paying tax on anything you buy from out of state for your own use. Like from Amazon or any other out of state vendor. Good luck! Jim
freelancerx Posted April 22, 2003 Posted April 22, 2003 I am setting up a shop for someone based in Ohio. Did you ever come to a conclusion on this issue? :) This is my signature. :P
timlitw Posted April 24, 2003 Posted April 24, 2003 If your weren't online the customer would come to your store and pay your local applicable tax. So now they come thru your door to your web sales counter, so non-technically it should be the same.
freelancerx Posted April 27, 2003 Posted April 27, 2003 Tim, Good point... I think I have heard that example before. :) (don't know how the logic escaped me) Anyway, I think that seems reasonable and logical... I will suggest my client charge his local counties tax. Thanks for the insight! This is my signature. :P
Akshara Posted May 3, 2003 Posted May 3, 2003 Charging everybody in your state the same tax rate is seriously against the law. In the state your store resides in, you have to charge state tax; and if your store resides in a city, you have to charge city tax to anybody buying who lives in that city. Just because it's online doesn't mean the local and state tax laws don't apply. And if you misappropriately charge people the wrong tax rate, it is against the law as well and you can get in a lot of legal and financial trouble. It's totally insane that this isn't dealt with appropriately in OsCommerce. It should definitely be in the top 3 of the "ToDo" list. We are trying to find a solution for applying city tax over here... http://www.oscommerce.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=160146
kalidust Posted May 4, 2003 Posted May 4, 2003 I'm in Louisiana and we're suppose to charge state tax if it is shipped within Louisiana, and also suppose to charge parish (we have parish instead of county) tax if it is shipped to someone in our parish. I just set up osCommerce for the first time for a customer and I have been trying to figure out the same thing to be able to charge parish tax if an order is shipped here.
Guest Posted May 4, 2003 Posted May 4, 2003 There is no problem as long as you remit the sales tax to the state (my background is in accounting). If your state requires that you pay the taxes for the county that product is delivered to then you must charge the highest amount collected in your state to cover all of the rates. I buy product from Microsoft and they charge the sales tax rate in the Seattle area which is higher than where I live. It is easier to take the path of least resistance. See next solution: The another approach to charge no sales tax but include the sale tax in the price of the product. Pay the sales tax when you file. Example: price of product is $10.00 sales tax .82 Total Price $10.82 No sale tax method: Total Price: $10.82 Divide by 1.082 = $ 0.82 is due to the state or whatever rate you are required to pay. Trying to install a script that will do it all is a huge task and really is NOT worth the trouble. Thomas Charging everybody in your state the same tax rate is seriously against the law. In the state your store resides in, you have to charge state tax; and if your store resides in a city, you have to charge city tax to anybody buying who lives in that city. Just because it's online doesn't mean the local and state tax laws don't apply. And if you misappropriately charge people the wrong tax rate, it is against the law as well and you can get in a lot of legal and financial trouble. It's totally insane that this isn't dealt with appropriately in OsCommerce. It should definitely be in the top 3 of the "ToDo" list. We are trying to find a solution for applying city tax over here... http://www.oscommerce.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=160146
Guest Posted May 4, 2003 Posted May 4, 2003 There is no problem as long as you remit the sales tax to the state (my background is in accounting). If your state requires that you pay the taxes for the county that product is delivered to then you must charge the highest amount collected in your state to cover all of the rates. I buy product from Microsoft and they charge the sales tax rate in the Seattle area which is higher than where I live. It is easier to take the path of least resistance. See next solution: The another approach to charge no sales tax but include the sale tax in the price of the product. Pay the sales tax when you file. Example: price of product is $10.00 sales tax .82 Total Price $10.82 No sale tax method: Total Price: $10.82 Divide by 1.082 = $ 0.82 is due to the state or whatever rate you are required to pay. Trying to install a script that will do it all is a huge task and really is NOT worth the trouble. Thomas Charging everybody in your state the same tax rate is seriously against the law. In the state your store resides in, you have to charge state tax; and if your store resides in a city, you have to charge city tax to anybody buying who lives in that city. Just because it's online doesn't mean the local and state tax laws don't apply. And if you misappropriately charge people the wrong tax rate, it is against the law as well and you can get in a lot of legal and financial trouble. It's totally insane that this isn't dealt with appropriately in OsCommerce. It should definitely be in the top 3 of the "ToDo" list. We are trying to find a solution for applying city tax over here... http://www.oscommerce.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=160146
Guest Posted May 4, 2003 Posted May 4, 2003 Sorry for the second posting. Thomas There is no problem as long as you remit the sales tax to the state (my background is in accounting).
Akshara Posted May 6, 2003 Posted May 6, 2003 There is no problem as long as you remit the sales tax to the state (my background is in accounting). This is not what we were told by local officials. And to your second solution, yes that's an option... but it's in Colorado it's still illegal. Here it is against the law to not inform the consumer of the exact amount of tax they are paying at the time of purchase. Trying to install a script that will do it all is a huge task and really is NOT worth the trouble. Actually if anybody would to take the time to seriously read the solution I've proposed it's quite simple - I just don't know the exact MySql syntax to make it work right. And about it not being worthwhile - if I don't find a solution to this that's LEGAL within the next week then I very well might have to trash our shopping cart and start over with another program altogether - so it is WAY worth it to find a solution to this that works. For individuals with County tax problems, I'm wondering if there's a way to convert the Canadian Tax contribution into an American County Tax solution. Anyway, please look at the thread over here if you want to help with the city tax solution... http://www.oscommerce.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=43228
Akshara Posted May 6, 2003 Posted May 6, 2003 FYI, from the local DRMC tax law ordinance... © Tax to be shown as separate item. Except as provided in this section, retailers shall add the tax imposed, or the average equivalent thereof, to the purchase price, showing such tax as a separate and distinctive item, and when added, such tax shall constitute a part of such price and shall be a debt from the purchaser to the retailer until paid, recoverable at law in the same manner as other debts. So your solution would be against this ordinance in the city of Denver, CO.
Akshara Posted May 6, 2003 Posted May 6, 2003 And to the idea that one can just charge everyone in the state the same tax rate... Sec. 53-41. Excess collections; failure to remit collections. If any vendor shall, during any reporting period, collect as a tax an amount in excess of the amount set forth in section 53-28 of this article during the reporting period, he shall return and pay over to the manager the full amount of the tax herein levied and also such excess. The retention by the retailer of any excess of tax collections over the aforesaid rate or the intentional failure to remit punctually to the manager the full amount required to be remitted by the provisions of this article shall be a violation of this article. (Ord. No. 666-81, ? 1, 12-14-81; Ord. No. 490-87, ? 1, 8-31-87)
Akshara Posted May 6, 2003 Posted May 6, 2003 So until someone shows me legal precedence or documentation from the State of Colorado and City of Denver that what we have been told by local legal counsel is not true and accurate, then I'm going by the information I have. I'd be really suprised if there aren't a lot of other states/cities with similar as tax laws as we have.
Guest Posted May 6, 2003 Posted May 6, 2003 I have a clear understanding of the rules and have used this in other busineses. My family once ran a concession stand in a local park. We were required to pay sales tax on the food items that we sold. We simply marked up the price to cover any and all expenses and then backed out the sales tax. We did this until we sold the business several years later. Here is what you are missing. Since you are not charging a sales tax (you are not breaking any law by not charging a sale tax) your only obligation is to remit to the state what is theirs. You are obligated to pay sales taxes for goods sold in your state. YOU are NOT obligated to charge your clients for it. Been there and done that! By marking up your prices to cost addition costs you solve the problem. A simple solution. Call your local accountant for advice for your problem until there is a software solution. Ask about gross sales method for paying sales tax. There is no problem as long as you remit the sales tax to the state (my background is in accounting). This is not what we were told by local officials. And to your second solution, yes that's an option... but it's in Colorado it's still illegal. Here it is against the law to not inform the consumer of the exact amount of tax they are paying at the time of purchase. The comment below is about trying to create and maintain a tax table for every state, city, county, parish in the US. Trying to install a script that will do it all is a huge task and really is NOT worth the trouble. FYI, from the local DRMC tax law ordinance... © Tax to be shown as separate item. Except as provided in this section, retailers shall add the tax imposed, or the average equivalent thereof, to the purchase price, showing such tax as a separate and distinctive item, and when added, such tax shall constitute a part of such price and shall be a debt from the purchaser to the retailer until paid, recoverable at law in the same manner as other debts. So your solution would be against this ordinance in the city of Denver, CO.
Akshara Posted May 6, 2003 Posted May 6, 2003 Hey... I'm not trying to be difficult with this, or to dispute your experience. I'm not the one at the company who has a big problem with this - I'm just the webdesigner. I have read much of our local tax ordinances, and what you are saying just doesn't add up with what I'm reading. Also, when I suggest to the business guys that they get some legal counsel on this, they say the already have, have been through all of this before, and this is how it stands... 1) If we charge everybody in the state the same tax rate, it's against the law. 2) If we don't list the State and/or City tax as seperate line items at checkout, it's against the law. 3) If we don't charge tax and just remit it from the total price, it's against the law. If we take tax, then we MUST inform the customer that they are paying tax at checkout. This solution was tried on a previous shopping cart, and we were informed to stop doing it. I understand and respect your experience as a food vendor. But we are an independant record label that sells a lot of products internationally. We also have a high visiblity with the local government because of online copyright and publishing issues in the music business. We can't skirt around with this and make it "kinda" work like most local "mom 'n pop" stores could get away with. So I'm simply trying to find the proper solution, and making sure that the others on this forum are educated to the issues as well. Thanks.
christlabs Posted May 7, 2003 Posted May 7, 2003 The way the laws read in regards to sales tax is, It is the responsibillity of the business to pay sales tax, the common practice for almost every business is to pass the tax on to the customer. To do that you either: Price of product + Tax added at checkout = customer pays, Price of product with tax included in displayed price = customer pays. Chris Guth Seniors Living Healthy Retail/Wholesale
Guest Posted May 7, 2003 Posted May 7, 2003 I am glad somebody understands. The problem with most people in this regard is that they KNOW the law but not the application of the law. Thomas The way the laws read in regards to sales tax is, It is the responsibillity of the business to pay sales tax, the common practice for almost every business is to pass the tax on to the customer. To do that you either: Price of product + Tax added at checkout = customer pays,Price of product with tax included in displayed price = customer pays.
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